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December 29, 2015 at 7:34 pm #5660Robert MangrumParticipant
I’m modeling 1978 Mopac in HO. I enjoy running a mix of 1st and 2nd gen diesels. Currently building a small switching layout that (hopefully) can be reusable in a future “white river” layout when more space is available.
Watching some older videos, I can see some of the nose class lights are on, many off, many painted over, etc. During my modeling period, as I understand, all trains were run as extras, which would normally require white class lights (or flags, etc.)
My question is: when did the mp railroad discontinue use of these lights on regular service? Would these be illuminated in 78 or were they discontinued by then?
Thank you for your assistance!December 29, 2015 at 8:49 pm #7350clemmie_doris12ParticipantGeorge,
The use of class lights is related to the operating rules in use. The adoption of the General Code of Operating Rules (GCOR) which replaced the Uniform Code of Operating Rules eliminated the use of class lights. I believe that this occurred on the MP in 1985. I remember taking the test, but I do not remember the month. I have train orders dated in 1985, so I would say that it was late in the year. Train orders were another tradition that went out the window with GCOR.
Even though they were no longer used after the effective date of the new rules, class lights were not immediately removed or painted over. My best guess is that it was well into 1986 and possibly later before there was any effort to “eradicate” class lights. They still had value as a marker light (red), in cases where there was a locomotive on the end of a train (pusher, etc.). That issue was resolved with the change in the rules that allowed a headlight on low to be used as a marker. I would have to research my old rule books to see when that happened. I always applauded Conrail for keeping red markers on their locomotives. As an operating employee, I have never been a fan of using the headlight for a marker.
In closing, I would like to address your comment about extras. Most freight trains were run as extras, but not all. The FFT (Ford Fast) and CSP (Chicago- St. Louis-Pueblo) were first class trains for a period of time in the early ’80s. As you pointed out, extras were required to display white class lights. Regular trains did not do this. In my time on the MP (1978 forward), we never used flags. And, I seldom, if ever, saw a train displaying green class lights to indicate a following section.
December 30, 2015 at 2:02 am #7662Robert MangrumParticipantSo, if I understand, it would be correct to add operating (clear) lights on (at least) the front end of the locos, but it was unlikely they would be illuminated unless true extra (not normal scheduled train) or (red) as rear pusher. This would be true in 1978 through 1985 (under up ownership).
I assume then this would likely be more in use on a larger layout with regularly scheduled trains, rather than a small switching layout. Equip the locos with class lights and use them infrequently (only true extra)
On my small layout then, clear illuminated class lights would be correct, extinguished when working the industries and on (on front) when returning?
MP didn’t use many lights on the locos, so to add class lights & step lights would look really cool!
Thanks for your help and any clarification.December 30, 2015 at 2:33 am #7663clemmie_doris12ParticipantGeorge,
In the era you are modeling, the vast majority (95% or better) of MP freight trains ran as extras. So, working white class lights would be a neat and authentic addition. They would be illuminated on the lead locomotive of a train that was authorized to run extra. There would be no need to turn the class lights off during any part of the tour of duty for that particular train.
From a modeling perspective, there would not be a big need for the red or green aspects on class lights. These two colors were not used that much in your era. Having working class lights on the rear of the locomotive would not be very necessary, either. Running long hood forward was not done all that often. If you have a local or TSE that runs with only one unit, you might consider adding working class lights to the rear of the units that might be assigned to that job. I agree, working class lights and ground lights would be cool on a model.
The merger did not have any major affect on MP operating practice until GCOR came along. From an operating rules and employee timetable perspective, the UP really didn’t bother with the MP until 1986.
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